A Big Laydown
A Huge Fold in the Cash Game at the Vic.
By Hugo Martin 29 February 2008
I recently played an interesting hand in the £100 pot limit Holdem game at the Victoria Casino. I had about £1,700 in front of me and was on the button when the following hand came up.The blinds in the £100 PLH game at the Vic are £3/£3 with an optional £6 straddle which Bill had put on. Joseph, under the gun to the straddle, made it £24 to play. I looked down to see Jd Jc and called.
The first blind folded and now the second blind, a regular player named Ray, re-raised the pot to £102 (a re-raise of £81). Bill, who had put the straddle on now went all-in for £137 which meant it was £113 to me and Joseph to call. We both called knowing that Ray could not raise again as Bill’s raise was an under-raise (note that either Joseph or myself could have re-raised if we had wanted to). There was now £548 in the pot.
The flop now came out 8h 4h Js. Ay, ay, bingo! Ray led out for £250, Joseph gave it a little dwell and called. Now it was up to me – hmmmm, what to do? I called and raised the pot, £1,290, essentially all-in as I had £105 left in my stack. Ray folded and now Joseph went into the tank. The look of agony on his face was something to behold and after about 3-5 minutes of trying to get me to talk he eventually folded. As he mucked his cards he turned them face up and revealed that he was passing a set of 8s! Wow, good fold sir.
Seeing as Bill was all-in the dealer burned and turned the turn and river cards and my set of jacks held up and I won a nice pot. Incidentally, Bill had pocket Kings and Ray had pocket Aces.
Pre-Flop
Let’s take a look at this hand in a bit more depth. First of all pre-flop I’m sure there are many of you saying, “Cor, I would’ve re-raised with JJ on the button”. You may well be right, but I have to admit I am from the school of thought that does not think that Jacks are a big pair. I would rather see a flop with them and see what my opponents like or dislike about the flop before I decide whether to get aggressive with them.
I did also have three players behind me yet to act and one of them could come alive with a big hand (which, as we know, did actually happen). One final point I have yet to make is that Joseph had me covered and Ray was playing about the same size stack as me. With these deep stacks I didn’t want to get too out of line and create a huge pot, even though I had the all-important button.
After Bill went all-in and Joseph flat called I had an easy call getting about 4-1 on my money. However, given the pre-flop action, it was fairly obvious that Ray had Aces or Kings and in my mind I was looking to hit a Jack on the flop. Joseph’s hand was definitely a mystery as I know he has a very wide range of hands he likes to play. I put him on any pair between 22-QQ and a bunch of suited connector type hands from 45 suited to AK.
The Flop
Obviously I really liked that flop and upon reflection raising the full pot after Ray bet and Joseph flat called was maybe over-egging it a little. Perhaps a better play would have been calling the £250 and raising an amount like £500. This is all easy to say, now that we know Joseph and Ray’s cards and Joseph’s subsequent action.
In my defence I had decided that the pot was getting big and if there’s one thing I have learnt after many years of playing is that the bigger the pot the more straightforward you want to play it. With that drawy board I felt that if I flat called or put in a “tempter” raise there were many cards that could come on the turn that would freeze the action – any heart or any of the straightening cards (5, 6, 7, 9, 10 or Queen). Essentially I was afraid of “losing my market”, as they say in backgammon.
Granted, some of those straightening cards are middle pins, but like I said, Joseph had a wide range of hands possible here including AK hearts or maybe 67 /9T/QT hearts. Many players would raise with those straight-and-flush draw type hands, but I felt that Joseph would flat call with that type of hand too.
I also felt (correctly, as it turned out) that Joseph had a big hand and would come along with me for the ride.
I guess Joseph’s big laydown says a lot about my image at the Vic and it will come as no surprise to you to hear that I have a reputation at the Vic for being a rock. Obviously I should have taken this more into account, and played the hand differently. A small raise would definitely have driven Ray out of the pot with his Aces (he is an experienced player who doesn’t get married to premium pairs after the pot), so, as I have already said above, this would have been the best play.
How Joseph can fold middle trips I’ll never know and I do think that can not be a profitable play in the long run. To be fair he obviously took into account his opponent’s tendencies and made his decision based on that. But would I have played bottom set (in this case it would have meant my hole cards would have been pocket 4s) or AK, 9T or 67 hearts in the same way as I played my top set?
With the pre-flop action being the way it was I guess Joseph decided I could not have trip 4s, but I know I could easily have been sucked in with that holding and I can assure you I would have played them exactly the same.
AK suited is another story and it’s possible I would have re-raised Joseph pre-flop with that hand, but I’m equally likely to have just smooth-called with them and then gotten sucked in. As for post flop I have to say I would’ve just flat called Ray’s £250 bet with my nut flush draw hoping to make my flush on the turn.
As for hands of the suited connector variety (in this case, 9T, 56, 67, maybe even 97) I could easily have gotten sucked in with these sorts of holdings too. It’s more likely that I would flat-call the flop bet, but I have been known on occasion to play a flush-and-straight draw aggressively.
Personally, I am not about to make a habit of folding middle set in Holdem (especially as basically we play those small and middle pairs to make trips, so folding when we do hit seems rather counter-productive) so I still think that even though he made the right play in that particular coup, in the grand scheme of things Joseph made a bad fold.
I guess I need to work on my image…..
29/02/08
